Draconic NEO

Oh awesome, I mean I’ve heard of other platforms like sublinks offering database migration but I didn’t think it would be feasible with piefed since unlike sublinks it’s very different than lemmy.

Yeah me too, I’d wanted to for a while but never got around to it. Now I probably never will (unless they get the servers back up at some point in the future).

Wouldn’t that mean the instance would completely restart? I mean I don’t know much about piefed but logically it seems like the DB structure would be incompatible. Thus “Migrating” to piefed means a complete reboot, all posts, all users, all content just bye bye.

They have stepped in when a lot of people complained, it took their whole instance complaining to do so while a Nazi troll spammed hate across the local feed.

Yeah I agree, that model just isn’t sustainable. Moderation is one of the most challenging aspects of running a Lemmy instance, and deciding to never defederate because of “free speech” and “user choice” just makes the job that much worse. It feels almost inevitable that instances like this will ultimately succumb to this type of burnout.

Really I feel like we should stop talking about “defederation” as an abstract concept without context or reason since it makes it seem like defederation happens for no reason. Which is almost never the case. We don’t talk about other forms of moderation that way, and if someone did it would be clear they’re one of those free speech trolls, so why do we so casually talk about defederation this way? Seriously, defederation, like any other moderation is 100% necessary, because humans are evil pieces of shit. Not all of them, but many are. That’s why we ban people, that’s why we defederate the most rotten places in the fediverse. Saying “just block users” is counterproductive. You know what Lemmy would look like if that’s all we offered here? Probably a more extreme version of 4chan, since those are the people that dominate when moderation isn’t enforced.

I don’t think the people here whining about moderation, defederation, and “Freeze Peach” care about any morality than their perceived right to say whatever they want without consequence.

Yeah moderation is the biggest challenge on Lemmy servers, they ended up making it more challenging for themselves with the decision to never defederate from any instance and lean all the way into the hysteria surrounding defederation. That’s really not a sustainable model for the long term, it increases workload, and drives off portions of the userbase who are sensitive to extreme or aggressive people (the people who run wild if you never defederate troll instances or ban trolls).

This is sad, but also not unexpected. I’d noticed a lack of engagement from their admin team for a while, and very often they wouldn’t respond to reports. Still sad to see them go, and also slightly worrying since there are a lot of active communities on there and many many users.

As great as it would’ve been to have Python on the Web instead of JS I don’t think that would’ve gone well when the Python foundation decided to make Python 3 incompatible with Python 2. That change already broke a lot of shit (Kodi addons never quite recovered from that) and I remember many people excusing it, but if websites ran on it, that wouldn’t have been inconvenient, it would’ve been far more devastating.

The only positive thing I ever heard about lemmy.one is that they federate with Beehaw. At the time I was already skeptical of that being a good thing since Beehaw has harsh opinions on moderation and had already said they wished to exit the Fediverse. So I dismissed lemmy.one back then as being one of those unremarkable and poorly managed instances, and it seems I was largely right. It is still sad to see an instance leave like this.

That’s kind of sad but also isn’t surprising. They didn’t exactly put in a huge amount of effort to maintain it, nor did they put in much effort to grow it or make it appealing as a server for people to join.

We shall see I guess, though unless they opt to only allow access to logged in users it’ll still be technically possible to do, especially locally in your own browser. Though people do lose interest over time, especially as platforms lose relevance.

I mean web scraping also exists and scraper based Reddit frontends have been and still are a thing. Also using accounts API isn’t ideal since they can figure out that an account is being used to look at stuff like that and either suspend it or worse just make shadowbans visible and not apparent to that account.

Can’t so easily fuck with a web scraper or tool just looking at the raw web page data.

I don’t really get why this solution isn’t used much or even suggested. I mean fetching the data without an account is a foolproof way to detect shadowbanning and silent removals. Frankly I’m surprised no one has simply made an extension or tool to do it automatically.

CC: @misk@sopuli.xyz @ProdigalFrog@slrpnk.net

I think you know pretty well already by now. NeoNazis, trolls, pedophiles. The usual bad faith actors who come here whining and hoping for people to believe them. Admins aren’t tolerating this anymore. Which is why every time you come back on an alt account, they don’t listen to you and instead ban you.

Agreed, email hosting is a pain. Also don’t get me started on just how unfriendly large email providers are to self-hosted email. Typically always false flagging it as spam and sometimes bouncing or dropping it instead of even sending to spam folder. People downplay this problem but it’s a serious problem when it comes to self-hosted or non-corporate email services.

This is amazing, it’s nice to have a scoring system to be able to rate how decentralized and also how active the different services are.

Mastodon and Sharkey (Misskey fork), though I use Sharkey much less.

I also have a Matrix account which is a different kind of Federated service (chat and instant messaging) though not Federated in the same way as Lemmy and Mastodon (uses a different federation protocol).

What do you think Federate means? It absolutely does, Matrix Federates over the Matrix protocol, which is a separate protocol from Activitypub which is what Lemmy and Mastodon use. It doesn’t Federate with Lemmy and Mastodon because they are different protocols but it absolutely does federate. Honestly there’s no reason for it to Federate with Lemmy and Masotodon. ActivityPub isn’t a good protocol to use for chatting, Matrix as a chat protocol is superior. Not to say that activitypub is bad, it’s great for social media platforms like forums and blogging, it’s just not good for instant messaging.

Make sure to also report the people you see being toxic, astroturfing, or downright attacking users. Many instances have policies against this and reporting them will increase the likelihood they’ll be dealt with, in some cases permanently.

This is something that should be discussed more since blocking is not a moderation function that makes the platform better, it’s a tool for people to pretend the problems don’t exist. I’m not a fan of pretending issues don’t exist, especially since I’m a mod and that would be insanely counter-productive.